Comments on: Checkers Solved http://v1.ripper234.com/p/checkers-solved/ Stuff Ron Gross Finds Interesting Sun, 02 Aug 2015 11:03:35 +0000 hourly 1 https://wordpress.org/?v=4.5.3 By: ripper234 http://v1.ripper234.com/p/checkers-solved/comment-page-1/#comment-282 Sat, 21 Jul 2007 15:58:00 +0000 http://localhost/p/checkers-solved/#comment-282 Well I guess it depends on the definition. I would define a game as “solved” if the solution gives the optimal strategy at any given game state. On probabilistic games this does not guarantee victory, but it does guarantee the best chance of victory.

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By: eli http://v1.ripper234.com/p/checkers-solved/comment-page-1/#comment-281 Sat, 21 Jul 2007 15:51:00 +0000 http://localhost/p/checkers-solved/#comment-281 Optimal strategy – yes.
Solution – no.

What is usually implied by solution is a strategy that *guarantees* some result. An optimal strategy in a probabilistic game can perhaps guarantee an average result over many games, but not a result in a single game.

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By: ripper234 http://v1.ripper234.com/p/checkers-solved/comment-page-1/#comment-280 Sat, 21 Jul 2007 09:17:00 +0000 http://localhost/p/checkers-solved/#comment-280 On a partially related subject, see an example of
a perfect information deterministic game with no winning strategy
(that is, if you believe
the Axiom of Choise).

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By: ripper234 http://v1.ripper234.com/p/checkers-solved/comment-page-1/#comment-279 Sat, 21 Jul 2007 09:09:00 +0000 http://localhost/p/checkers-solved/#comment-279 I don’t agree. Even probabilistic games (as long as they’re Perfect Information) can have an optimal strategy.

One could theoretically construct a database with all possible backgammon games and deduce the chances of winning from every position – and so come with the best strategy. I think the problem is this database would be extremely large.

Games that may not have a winning strategy are those with some hidden information – Prisoner’s Dilemma and Poker come to mind.

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By: Eli http://v1.ripper234.com/p/checkers-solved/comment-page-1/#comment-278 Sat, 21 Jul 2007 09:01:00 +0000 http://localhost/p/checkers-solved/#comment-278 While backgammon can’t be “solved” because of its probabilistic nature, programs play it way better than humans for a long time now. IIRC, the guy who wrote the program used Neural Nets to study games and infer strategy.

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By: ripper234 http://v1.ripper234.com/p/checkers-solved/comment-page-1/#comment-277 Fri, 20 Jul 2007 18:29:00 +0000 http://localhost/p/checkers-solved/#comment-277 You’re right of course, this is the result of writing a post in 5 seconds without thinking 🙂

Now that I think about it, I doubt Shesh-Besh (Backgammon) could actualy be solved so easily – it’s randomized, which adds another dimension of complexity to it all. It’s still a sucky game though, and I enjoy Checkers more as it’s less dependant on luck.

I know some players adhere to the view that backgammon is a game of skill, but to me it always looked like an ars game.

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By: Ido http://v1.ripper234.com/p/checkers-solved/comment-page-1/#comment-276 Fri, 20 Jul 2007 18:05:00 +0000 http://localhost/p/checkers-solved/#comment-276 Checkers isn’t “shesh-besh”, mate. It’s Damka

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